Is there a limit??

[GzrGldGeo]

The Iraq war is now up to $12B a month from $10B a month.

What level of US poverty and casualties is too much?

Is there a limit?

I know the benefits are too numerous to mention, but at what price is this just too much cost for the huge benefits??

Is there a limit?

There is no limit to the amount of money those in Washington will take from you in the name or war, health care, welfare, etc.

I say we need change!!

[mrpiff]

Climbed back up on that stump huh. You must be feeling better :lol:

[Fubar]

Well it's a "LOADED" question that's for sure....if you don't believe in this war, every nickle is too much, if you do believe in this war, freedom and American lives have no price....hows that for a "loaded" retort

[GzrGldGeo]

I believe in war when it is justified and when we can afford it. I am not sure the one in Iraq meets either criteria.

So I wouldn't say I am against this or any other war.

So is there no limit?

I never left the stump Piff. I am just hoping I am missing something on Iraq and McCain. I don't see anyone making any great arguments for either.

I have been a life long Republican but am or have fallen by the wayside. I am not saying I back Democrats but if you don't back repubs what choice do you have??????

I was 150% behind this war until I started questioning Faux News on other subjects which led to this one. Since I have stopped watching Faux News I can't see where the money we are spending nor the risk we put our Citizens in is justified.

When we spend $12B a month I just have to ask for what? The answers aren't there so I assume it is to make Washington rich.

If the answers are there please point them out to me.

I really feel like some of you think I am less an American to even have these thoughts. You are free to think what you want. I am not sure you can get much more American than me though. I was and am still hoping there will be an America for my Grand kids if I ever have any.

I am just trying to get good arguments out of any of you that is all. In the absence of those arguments I have to unfortunately come to the conclusion I may be on the right track.

Please tell me I am wrong.

[mrpiff]

I have never, not even for an instant, questioned your patriotism or love for America George!

We have never been able to afford any war we have entered into as a country from the very begining. We borrowed from other counties to fight the revolutionary war.

I believe what we are doing in the middle east is something we can't afford not to do! After 9/11 we had no choice but to go after the terrorists where they were holed up and those that protect and enable them. It never has been about whether or not Iraq had WMD to me. It's about rooting out and uncerimoniously (sp) extinguising those terrorists. Most of them are hiding in Iran now, and that's where we need to go after them in my opinion.

George, you have every right to believe whatever you choose to believe, and I'm willing to fight to the death to protect that right!
Thank God so many others are ready also!

[GzrGldGeo]

Do you feel a war should have a defined mission and a defined budget?

Does this one have either?

Who is the enemy? Sunni's? Shia's? Al Queda? Sadaam?

Let's see.....
No defineed mission?
No defined enemy?
No defined budget?

I think we won this a long time ago and we are just making Washington rich and the rest of us poor at this point. Bush gave a victory speech years ago.

[GzrGldGeo]

Thanks Piff.

I don't see why Iraq is any more or any less important than about 100 countires aroudn the world. We can't and shouldn't be trying to rule the world in my opinion.

[mikedetejas]

The war in Iraq is not about terrorism. Terrorism is just a sympton of a much larger issue. What George Bush has failed to articulate, and what the rest of Western Civilization will not wake up to is, we are facing a culture war between Islam and Christianity. Al Qaeda is being supported with weapons, money and/or by tacit approval of every Islamic nation. Iran, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Palestine, Indonesia, Pakistan, etc etc.
Until Western Civilization wakes up and realizes that Islam is determined to be the dominant culture, we are pissing in the wind in Iraq. This culture clash cannot be won by the US with just the backing of a few troops from various nations.

[GzrGldGeo]

I agree mikedetejas....

That is another reason to be spending our money on better things than pissing all those Terrorist off. We need to be winning their hearts and minds some how/some way. I don't think Iraq is helping that cause at all and for $12B a month.

If they are that dengerous we need to kill them all and aren't even tryng to do so.

I am more convinced daily that this is just a way to steal our money. I am sure the leaders of China and Korea just laugh and talk about how quickly they will be running the US. Hell maybe they convinced Bush Iraq was really dangerous. Iran hasn't invaded any country in over 300 years, but the war drums are beating.

I guess it beats having to discuss education, health care, the job CRISIS, Social Security, the economy, the demise of our civil rights, etc. At least Iraq is the biggest issue we have.

I hope I am wrong about our direction.

[Fubar]

War is full of politics, and yes the chosen few do profit from it, but in the end no war is perfect, none.

Here are some of my opinions, I'll try to keep them brief:

3 reasons why the US and it's allies can NEVER leave the middle east:

1. Oil
2. International stability
3. Islamic terrorists


#1. This is the one they will never admit, but in my mind should make NO apologies for.
- Why did Japan attack the US at Pearl Harbour?
Answer: In 1941 The US cut of exports of oil to Japan, a country who's oil consupmtion was growing rapidly.
- Now flash foward to today, the world is still predominately fueled by oil
- China will soon pass the US in oil consumption, which is no small task
- China is growing it's military at an exponential rate, and today has the world's largest manned army
- China's motives will allows be clouded, after all they are a communist country who has no more value on human life, then Satan himslef
- The US NEEDS to secure their place in the supply chain, or all hell could and will break lose.


#2 Wiithout a strong US presence in the middle east, the future would be ominous at best
- Insert Iran; this is a country who openly despises the west
- They have publically threated the future of Israel
- An attack on Israel would make the middle east a nuclear cluster fuck, and further disprupt the worlds economic harmonies(oil), a full blown world war would be imminent, to get shit back to normal.
- and last but not least their loyalties are up for sale...remember China's needs????

#3 Islamic fundamentalists, are at the route of all that evil in the middle east, they will control the population with fear and intimidation, and they will continue to plot death and destruction to the west. A constant disruption to their long term plans is nessesary(US in Iraq and The Ghan). After all these insurgents are all working for the terrorist governments, that on the surface we treat diplomatically, but anybody in the know, understands the true motives of both the terrorists and the governments who support them, and that is world dominance, through death, fear, and the ultimate control of the worlds oil supplies.


This is one Canuck who is not only proud to support the US in all it's efforts in the middle east, but is also damn happy that they are our neighbour.

I suuport the mission, and the troops....Vietnam was an underfunded war....Iraq is also an underfunded war being fought in the press and congress....to me with everything that is at stake(per above) is one sad state of affairs.

Ferchrisakes give the men what they need to do the job, your childrens kids will be glad that your government is doing what is nessesary today to secure all of us for the future. I know that is what I tell my child.

God Bless all of our troops

The front of my home....